Government MPs have recommended an "unprecedented," severe penalty for Te Pāti Māori but there is inconsistency, as David Seymour's breaches go unaddresssed.
What makes the National/ACT/NZ First claims even more galling is the minority report in the decision by Te Pāti Māori. Here is an extract
"We reject the misrepresentation of DebbieNgarewa-Packer's gesture as simulating a firearm. Themotion in question was a wiri-a trembling, deliberate expression of emotional intensity rooted in haka and Māori oratory. The word she expressed at the conclusion of the haka was "kino", not "e noho" as the committee has reported."
Everything they say is an excuse for what they truly want. Everything they claim is cover for their real motivations, decided upon before any "review" or analysis. That's why there's so much hypocrisy at every step, in my view.
As TPM said earlier this week, the truly offensive c-word this week is colonialism. And: "We'll give him a fair trial. Then we'll hang him" was said by King Louis XV in the film Du Barry Was a Lady (1943).”
Intimidated??? By a Haka in New Zealand? Have these people never gone through a greeting at a Marae? Never been to an NZ cultural event? Do they sit right at tha back of rugby stadiums in case it feels a bit scary? These people have all risen to Government positions in New Zealand whilst scared of the Haka!? Come on press....time to laugh ourselves silly about these frightened people.
Once again, racist politicians talking to their racist base. And all the tone policing too... So indigenous people in their own land can't communicate their views in the way that they traditionally always have? Smacks of colonialism, through and through.
This Govt is acting in ways that they believe the electorate will accept. If we think their policies, Bills passed and justifications are wrong we need to express our opinions loudly.
I fear some in the electorate are accepting of the "correctness" and focus of their party leaders. For example, yesterday I checked out one party leader's Facebook page - he leads off with a statement which I strongly suspect he knows will keep his faithful in line - standards of attire in parliament, then uncouth language and previously he has made derogatory comments about gay members and so it goes on. It is as if he is herding a flock of sheep when you read through his supporters' comments. It is those very voters who regard themselves as middle of the road who might respond to a different conversation. I agree with you that we need to express our opinions - or when we can, challenge claims with facts. Strategically, I think we all need to be involved, be it by academic critique or one sentence comment. Everyone's input has significant value to offer, even if we are not wordsmiths. To fend off the persuasiveness of some current govt rhetoric we need "all hands on deck". Sorry for the rant!
Ditto that MT and to the youth and the apathetic, there has to be a way of cutting through the spin and bullshit of the government. The entire left block need to come together here and encourage ordinary kiwis to stand and yell “enough is enough!”
I am a proud Australian and I concur with the Australian ‘MT’ has quoted here. I could not say it better, so I’ll quote the Aussie too, “Watching that clip gives me chills. What an extraordinarily powerful display of strength and pride in culture and identity.” If only those in government would display the same gravitas. Alas, what New Zealand has ended up with is an integrity free government lead by a wet-fish handshake PM, who is diminutive in stature, devoid of truth, free of intelligence, and without mana.
As the saying goes, the fish rots from the head down. I can smell the stench in Luxon’s office from Stewart Island. Using a word from the Noongar people in my home state of Western Australia I say ‘Pindjarri’, which translates as power and lightening. May Hana bring plenty more of it to the New Zealand parliament.
"Labour's Kieran McAnulty asked if Brownlee would consider allowing the final vote on the report and the punishment - which could be amended - to be a personal vote rather than on party lines, but Brownlee said no."
🤬 Once again the members of the coalition have been exposed as cynical manipulators with their strategies to silence and/or demonise articulate & effective communicators who expose the corruption, lies, racism, misogyny, selfishness, hubris, etc etc etc that seems to underpin everything they do. (I could add incompetence but unfortunately they are effective so far 🥹 in this, if not actual governing⁉️) At the least, I hope this is not supported by the rest of Parliament, but by then it will be too late (or can the Opposition get anything brought under "urgency"?) Things in favour of Seymour will even get worse when he has the added bully pulpit of Deputy PM soon 🤢🤮 Let us hope that members of TPM continue to be strong voices & Labour & the Greens ensure the constituency of TPM get a fair chance during the relevant debates 👍
🤔 As well as this obvious strategy to keep TPM out during these vitally important sessions affecting TPM communities most specifically, they have attempted to keep certain sectors out of "lockups" relating to govt economic performance by excluding the CTU & it's economist Craig Renney when they stopped several organisations attending Treasury briefings for the first time last year, then explaining the criteria for journalists to attend, then excluding him under the excuse he was not a "journalist", then when he was put forward as a journalist under the rules outlined by Treasury by his BHN colleagues for whom he does "journalism", they said BHN could send anyone but Renney 😱, and then relented & allowed CTU & others to attend but said they could send "anyone but Renney" 😱 I believe that due to public backlash highlighting this personal vendetta by the Finance Minister against someone who is able to expose and explain the ACTUAL consequences & facts behind the gaslighting this lot do, NOW Mr Renney will be ALLOWED to be in the lockup so that by the time the embargo ends, he, like the reps from major banks & business interests etc, will have had time to offer analysis which may or may not contradict the govt explanations for what is contained. Those being excluded puts them at a disadvantage over the preferred govt lackeys & sycophants & gets the govt "message" out before there is time for timely competent fact checking, which was the intention of course 🤷. (Pushback helps, so we all need to do our bit where we can 💪)
As an aside, anyone struggling to understand the differences between equal pay, pay equity, pay parity etc & the affects the changes just rammed through under urgency will have, Craig Renney's ironically named podcast/YouTube called "Locked out" is worth watching (the slides on the YouTube version really help) & bookmarking for keeping us focused on the issues, rather than a journalist calling out the women of the coalition for setting back all of that to 1972 when this legislation was first enacted 🤔
"When he was put forward as a journalist under the rules outlined by Treasury by his BHN colleagues for whom he does "journalism", they said BHN could send anyone but Renney 😱, and then relented & allowed CTU & others to attend but said they could send "anyone but Renney"
That happened?!
I saw that retraction but didn't realise that's how it went down. Absolutely shameful in every single way.
Thanks for the referral to Craig's podcast, Cindy, he did an AMA on Reddit nzpolitics -and was brilliant.
👍 I like his "work" because he is one of those people who is obviously competent & educated in his field of expertise, but doesn't talk "down" to those of us who don't have the background but want to understand these decisions that affect us and our whanui. 🤔
That slug was never going to agree to that and the right want all dissenters visible to them. NZ needs compulsory voting but watch the right howl against that too. It would be their undoing, which is another important message to get out there
How can these people in government, and their ignorant supporters, call themselves New Zealanders if they don’t recognise our 600 years of history prior to the arrival of canvas sails?
Banning three MPs from the House for even one week, let alone three, deprives constituents in three sizeable electorates - Hauraki-Waikato, Waiariki and Te Tai Hauāuru - of representation.
How is this legal??
I truly hope Hipkins has the spoons to take on a filibuster; I fear he may not.
“Is Labour keen to disrupt the House in this way? That’s something the caucus will have to work out on Tuesday morning, when it meets to discuss the issue.
On the one hand, the party doesn’t want to look like an agent of chaos to middle voters who want some sobriety restored to politics. It also doesn’t want to align itself too closely to Te Pāti Māori.
There might also be a concern about precedent, but the potential for a filibuster here is the result of a unique confluence of events. The only debates that have no time limit and come before the Government’s business of the day (so before urgency can be declared) are debates on reports of the Privileges Committee.”
Exactly, Labour and its allies should keep their powder dry as you say to benefit from a filibuster so watch the PM suggest amelioration from the get-go and reduce the penalty. To avoid the filibuster however I think he will have to move that there be no penalty! Magnanimity that will win him world acclaim
What makes the National/ACT/NZ First claims even more galling is the minority report in the decision by Te Pāti Māori. Here is an extract
"We reject the misrepresentation of DebbieNgarewa-Packer's gesture as simulating a firearm. Themotion in question was a wiri-a trembling, deliberate expression of emotional intensity rooted in haka and Māori oratory. The word she expressed at the conclusion of the haka was "kino", not "e noho" as the committee has reported."
Thank you Andrew, and I will add this clarification.
It's hard to see how it wasn't a setup - with their deceptive assertions. I'm very disappointed the media didn't pick this up.
Not surprising re the media… 😓🤬
As if Seymour felt intimidated. He sat there smugly. This is a severe response and just wrong.
Everything they say is an excuse for what they truly want. Everything they claim is cover for their real motivations, decided upon before any "review" or analysis. That's why there's so much hypocrisy at every step, in my view.
I have no doubt Seymour felt and continues to feel intimidated, not by the haka though, but by the opposition to his bill.
A bit of an authoritarian bent that guy, doesn't like it when someone talks back to him either.
Don't get me wrong, I see the aggrieved adolescent.
As TPM said earlier this week, the truly offensive c-word this week is colonialism. And: "We'll give him a fair trial. Then we'll hang him" was said by King Louis XV in the film Du Barry Was a Lady (1943).”
Keith - thank you. I just realised this one sentence summarises everything I have been trying to say. I may use it everywhere now. Nga mihi.
Intimidated??? By a Haka in New Zealand? Have these people never gone through a greeting at a Marae? Never been to an NZ cultural event? Do they sit right at tha back of rugby stadiums in case it feels a bit scary? These people have all risen to Government positions in New Zealand whilst scared of the Haka!? Come on press....time to laugh ourselves silly about these frightened people.
Just a front to make it sound serious so they could have an excuse to throw a hammer at TPM. Disgraceful MPs and parties in govt.
Absolutely! That's why it should be treated with derision by all of us.
Yes - derision it is!
Once again, racist politicians talking to their racist base. And all the tone policing too... So indigenous people in their own land can't communicate their views in the way that they traditionally always have? Smacks of colonialism, through and through.
It absolutely does. Shameful.
This Govt is acting in ways that they believe the electorate will accept. If we think their policies, Bills passed and justifications are wrong we need to express our opinions loudly.
I fear some in the electorate are accepting of the "correctness" and focus of their party leaders. For example, yesterday I checked out one party leader's Facebook page - he leads off with a statement which I strongly suspect he knows will keep his faithful in line - standards of attire in parliament, then uncouth language and previously he has made derogatory comments about gay members and so it goes on. It is as if he is herding a flock of sheep when you read through his supporters' comments. It is those very voters who regard themselves as middle of the road who might respond to a different conversation. I agree with you that we need to express our opinions - or when we can, challenge claims with facts. Strategically, I think we all need to be involved, be it by academic critique or one sentence comment. Everyone's input has significant value to offer, even if we are not wordsmiths. To fend off the persuasiveness of some current govt rhetoric we need "all hands on deck". Sorry for the rant!
Not a rant - excellent points!
Not a rant - a timely reminder that we all need to stand and be counted, especially as other forces rally against us. If not now, when?
Ditto that MT and to the youth and the apathetic, there has to be a way of cutting through the spin and bullshit of the government. The entire left block need to come together here and encourage ordinary kiwis to stand and yell “enough is enough!”
I am a proud Australian and I concur with the Australian ‘MT’ has quoted here. I could not say it better, so I’ll quote the Aussie too, “Watching that clip gives me chills. What an extraordinarily powerful display of strength and pride in culture and identity.” If only those in government would display the same gravitas. Alas, what New Zealand has ended up with is an integrity free government lead by a wet-fish handshake PM, who is diminutive in stature, devoid of truth, free of intelligence, and without mana.
As the saying goes, the fish rots from the head down. I can smell the stench in Luxon’s office from Stewart Island. Using a word from the Noongar people in my home state of Western Australia I say ‘Pindjarri’, which translates as power and lightening. May Hana bring plenty more of it to the New Zealand parliament.
💯 Also I laughed a little re: the descriptions...
"Fish rots from the head down" is a reflection I've felt more than once about this govt.
Thanks for another Aussie voice! The Aussies hit the nail on the head and speaks for so many of us.
We wait to discover how the full parliament will consider and handle the diabolically repressive recommendation to suspend Te Pati Māori MPs.
"Labour's Kieran McAnulty asked if Brownlee would consider allowing the final vote on the report and the punishment - which could be amended - to be a personal vote rather than on party lines, but Brownlee said no."
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/561112/privileges-committee-report-on-te-pati-maori-s-haka-to-be-debated-voted-on-next-tuesday
Yes, I appreciated that from Kieran. Of course, Brownlee wouldn't accept the suggestion.
🤬 Once again the members of the coalition have been exposed as cynical manipulators with their strategies to silence and/or demonise articulate & effective communicators who expose the corruption, lies, racism, misogyny, selfishness, hubris, etc etc etc that seems to underpin everything they do. (I could add incompetence but unfortunately they are effective so far 🥹 in this, if not actual governing⁉️) At the least, I hope this is not supported by the rest of Parliament, but by then it will be too late (or can the Opposition get anything brought under "urgency"?) Things in favour of Seymour will even get worse when he has the added bully pulpit of Deputy PM soon 🤢🤮 Let us hope that members of TPM continue to be strong voices & Labour & the Greens ensure the constituency of TPM get a fair chance during the relevant debates 👍
🤔 As well as this obvious strategy to keep TPM out during these vitally important sessions affecting TPM communities most specifically, they have attempted to keep certain sectors out of "lockups" relating to govt economic performance by excluding the CTU & it's economist Craig Renney when they stopped several organisations attending Treasury briefings for the first time last year, then explaining the criteria for journalists to attend, then excluding him under the excuse he was not a "journalist", then when he was put forward as a journalist under the rules outlined by Treasury by his BHN colleagues for whom he does "journalism", they said BHN could send anyone but Renney 😱, and then relented & allowed CTU & others to attend but said they could send "anyone but Renney" 😱 I believe that due to public backlash highlighting this personal vendetta by the Finance Minister against someone who is able to expose and explain the ACTUAL consequences & facts behind the gaslighting this lot do, NOW Mr Renney will be ALLOWED to be in the lockup so that by the time the embargo ends, he, like the reps from major banks & business interests etc, will have had time to offer analysis which may or may not contradict the govt explanations for what is contained. Those being excluded puts them at a disadvantage over the preferred govt lackeys & sycophants & gets the govt "message" out before there is time for timely competent fact checking, which was the intention of course 🤷. (Pushback helps, so we all need to do our bit where we can 💪)
As an aside, anyone struggling to understand the differences between equal pay, pay equity, pay parity etc & the affects the changes just rammed through under urgency will have, Craig Renney's ironically named podcast/YouTube called "Locked out" is worth watching (the slides on the YouTube version really help) & bookmarking for keeping us focused on the issues, rather than a journalist calling out the women of the coalition for setting back all of that to 1972 when this legislation was first enacted 🤔
"When he was put forward as a journalist under the rules outlined by Treasury by his BHN colleagues for whom he does "journalism", they said BHN could send anyone but Renney 😱, and then relented & allowed CTU & others to attend but said they could send "anyone but Renney"
That happened?!
I saw that retraction but didn't realise that's how it went down. Absolutely shameful in every single way.
Thanks for the referral to Craig's podcast, Cindy, he did an AMA on Reddit nzpolitics -and was brilliant.
👍 I like his "work" because he is one of those people who is obviously competent & educated in his field of expertise, but doesn't talk "down" to those of us who don't have the background but want to understand these decisions that affect us and our whanui. 🤔
Very much so, like him too.
Damn. A conscience vote would have been appropriate here.
That slug was never going to agree to that and the right want all dissenters visible to them. NZ needs compulsory voting but watch the right howl against that too. It would be their undoing, which is another important message to get out there
How can these people in government, and their ignorant supporters, call themselves New Zealanders if they don’t recognise our 600 years of history prior to the arrival of canvas sails?
Banning three MPs from the House for even one week, let alone three, deprives constituents in three sizeable electorates - Hauraki-Waikato, Waiariki and Te Tai Hauāuru - of representation.
How is this legal??
I truly hope Hipkins has the spoons to take on a filibuster; I fear he may not.
Agree. It's undemocratic, if the shoe was on the other foot.
Sorry what is Hipkins supposed to do here?
Per Mark Daalder in Newsroom:
“Is Labour keen to disrupt the House in this way? That’s something the caucus will have to work out on Tuesday morning, when it meets to discuss the issue.
On the one hand, the party doesn’t want to look like an agent of chaos to middle voters who want some sobriety restored to politics. It also doesn’t want to align itself too closely to Te Pāti Māori.
There might also be a concern about precedent, but the potential for a filibuster here is the result of a unique confluence of events. The only debates that have no time limit and come before the Government’s business of the day (so before urgency can be declared) are debates on reports of the Privileges Committee.”
https://newsroom.co.nz/2025/05/16/how-the-opposition-could-derail-budget-day-and-save-te-pati-maori/
Ah I see. There's no strategic advantage of playing into this, in my view. Labour should keep their powder dry.
Exactly, Labour and its allies should keep their powder dry as you say to benefit from a filibuster so watch the PM suggest amelioration from the get-go and reduce the penalty. To avoid the filibuster however I think he will have to move that there be no penalty! Magnanimity that will win him world acclaim